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How long ago is it since he found you out ? He saw me there.
You know that is not iny questioni. believe it might be in the course of a day or two afterwards.
Was not you sent for before the Coroner's inquisition fat on the body of Casson ?I do not know when that sat; I saw Ward with his stick up like the other chairmen.
Had he his blue great coat on cannot say, I was not close to him above a ininute before I was knocked down.
You had never seen Ward before in your life?--No; I remember the features of the man, I do not remember any thing particular he had in his dr fs.
Mr. Baron Perryn. Did you see any borly strike the deceased at any time?-No.
JOSEPH GILMORE sworn.
Examined by Mr. Sylvester.
What are you?-A carpenter; I live at the Three Tuns in Fleet-street; I was at Covent Garden on the roth of May.
see the deceased Callon struck?-I did. Whó ítruck himn - This man in the blue coat with a red cape, Patrick Nicholson.
What did you see himn strike the deceased with ?-A large stick with a nob to it.
Which side of the head did he strike him?—That I cannot say particularly, whether it was the right or left.
Did he fall with the blow he received ? -Yes.
Did any thing happen after that ?-I did not see any thing more; I saw him taken into Wood's Hotel two minutes after. Are
you sure that man was the man that struck the deceased ?-I am sure of it, upon my word, upon my honour, and upon my oath.
Have you feen him since the affair ?-Never.
Cross-examined by Mr. Erskine.
When was it that you made this discovery to any body that you are telling us now ?-Yesterday in the afternoon, the reasons I will tell you presently,
You saw this man struck by the prisoner at the bar - I did. · Then you knew at the time, for you say you saw him carried into Wood's Hotel, that that was the man that was killed ?- I imagined him to be the man by his dress.
Perhaps then you can favour us with the reason why you did not make the discovery sooner?--My reason was this, I had made application before concerning the striking of Mr. Nash'; one Kenny had ftruck Nash, I gave my address as living over the water, at the General Elliot, in Blackman-street; I had never heard any thing of the matter, and I came up to the Old Bailey yesterday about a little bufiness I had of my own in hand, and I lighted of Mr. Nash; I spoke to him, and asked him if that affair was coming on; he said it was to come on this day, and theretore defired I would attend the Old Bailey; I then gave a second address where I did live, and as such I received notice to attend this morning.
As soon as this man was struck, you saw him carried into Wood's Hotel -I went. away from there and went round, and I came round to Wood's Hotel, and the man was brought in
You saw Nash assaulted ?-Yes,
How long after ?---I suppose it might be very near an hour after that affair happened. Have you ever seen the prisoner at the bar before?
-I had seen him in the Garden before, and I had seen him at fome houses; I never saw isim do any outrageous act.
Was not you examined before the Justice about Kenny ?-Yes, and that is the very reason I affert what I do.
You told nobody of this there?--No, I was never asked.
You never mentioned it?-I was asked whether that was the man that hit Casson, I told them, no; I was not asked whether or no I saw Caflon hit or no, that question was never asked me.
Will you swear that ?-I will, Sir; the question was never asked me to my knowledge; the question asked me was, whether I had seen that man strike Casson; I faid, no. Did you say you had seen him struck ?-I did. Did you say by whom? – I did not, because I did not know his name. Did you
endeavour to describe his person, that he might be apprehended ? No, I never was asked.
You knew that the Justice was fitting to enquire into the death of Casson ?-Yes.
Was not you then asked ?—Never to my knowledge, there was not such a question
know that Gentleman ?-Yes. Did he not put any such question ?-No.
Did you not know that the very purpose for which the magistrate was sitting, was to see whether it could be found out who it was that struck the mortal blow The purpose that I went for was, to be a witness whether that man was the man or not; I was asked whether Kenny was the man; I did not say to the Justice that I knew who the man was; I said that I knew several that was in the crowd.
Now you know that Kenny was only charged with aslifting somebody that killed him? Yes.
Not charged with having struck the blow at Caffon himself, but with affisting fomebody that had; you knew that fact? I did.
Then you knowing who the person was, that was unknown to the Justice, that had struck him, whom Kenny was supposed to have assisted, did not tell the Justice ?- The question never was put.
Who fhewed you Nicholson yesterday?-Nobody at all, I did not see him yesterday; I knew the man when he came to the bar, and I had not seen him but five or fix times.
What was your other bufiness at the Old Bailey - I had a little job, a lock, and I was going to get a key to it.
Was it about no trial ?-No, Sir.
Did not you come with Nash with a brief to that gentleman ?-No, never in my life, nor never knew him.
Nor you know nothing of the matter ?-No, Sir.
Court. How did you know that this was the man that was taken into custody when you did not know his name?-I heard that the man was in custody, and as I was coming, I saw Nash, and asked him when his affair came on concerning Kenny; he said he did not know; fays I, I have had no notice of it, it has amazed me much; says he, I believe it will come on to-morrow, as the nen are in custody; you must attend to-morrow morning at nine o'clock; accordingly this morning a person came to me to defire me to come down to the Old Bailey, and I was then informed that the men were in custody.
Did you know his name before ? I did not, nor do I know that that is his name now.
You came quite accidentally to the Old Bailey yesterday Yes, I did not know till yesterday that I came up, that these men were to be tried, I did not know a word of it, I was going to search the brokers for a key, I went to several, their names I do not know.
In what street did you go to any fhop-In Turnmill-ftreet, and Peter-street, and Cow-crois, and now the lock lays at Mr. Ive's, ironmonger, in Fleet-street; I could not get a key to it.
Do you remember the marrow-bones and cleavers ? —I do.
Was it before or after this man received his death wound that they marched ?-The marrow-bones and cleavers came first.
Did not you say it was in King-itreet you saw the affray ?-I saw Nash knocked down in King-ftreet.
Mr. Sylvester. When you was before the magistrate, were either of the prisoners in cuftody then -Not that I saw. .
EDWARD ARNOLD (worx.
Examined by Mr. Morgan.
Mr. Morgan. Where do you live -At No. 2, in Mount Pleasant; I was at Covent Garden on the 10th of May; I saw Casson struck.
How was he dressed in a snuff-coloured coat and a green waistcoat.
Mr. Fielding. And loook round the Court, look here. That is the man in the blue coat and a red cape, Nicholson, that is the man I saw strike Caron twice.
Did you see him do any thing elle?-I think he jumped upon him.
to the middle.)
Cross-examined by Mr. Pigot. How happened you to be at Covent Garden ?-I happened to be ill, and curiosity led me there; I had no hand in the riot; I was there between one and two, and staiú there till the Election was over.
You only took a solitary walk :-Yes.
know Gilmore-Yes. Where does he live, in your neighbourhood --He is an old acquaintance of mine ; we were not together,
He was there by accident, as you was ? - Very likely.
You say Nicholson is the man ?-I think he was the fame man, the person in the blue coat and red cape, that gave the blow.
Did you ever fee hun before Never in my life.
So the features of a man whom you have never seen before, and never saw since, you know perfectly well ?-I think he is the very man.
Now, Mr. Arnold, you do not know how he was dressed ?—No, it is the features of the man; I saw the man carried to Wood's Hotel, I never moved from the place where I stood.
How near was it from the place where Caffon received the blow? I stood a little distance from the back of the Gentlemen, by the steps going up to the Hustings; when the man was carried away I went up to the other end of the Hustings, I went with him, I never quitted the place where I stood till he was carried to Wood's Hotel.
Was he carried immediately from the place where he fell to Wood's Hotel - In the course of two minutes.
And you followed him?--Yes.
There was some examination into the matter by the Coroner's Inquest ?–I did not ftop any longer.
Do you know, or do you not know, that whenever a man is killed there is always an examination before a Coroner? - Yes.
Did you go before that Coroner's Inquest, and tell that you knew the man that had given Casson a mortal blow ?-No.
Did you ever offer to talk with Gilinore ?-I told him, we were speaking together, and I said it was a cruel thing to see a man murdered in that way.
When might you happen to have this conversation with Gilmore, last Friday se'nnight ?- No, Sir, it was last Wednesday.
What did Gilmore fay upon that?-He said he could give his oath that he saw the man, and I told him the fame when we were in discourse together last Wednesday.
Court. Gilmore faid he never spoke to any person about it, let himn be asked.
You met him accidentally ?-I did, and he said he thought he could swear to the man; I said I thought I should know the man too.
Did you tell any body else of it?- The person I work for, Mr. Stokes, he advised me to come and tell what I did know; I have not mentioned a word about it till this day.
Then from Saturday till to-day you never spoke to any body ?-No.
Mr. Morgan. In a cross-examination of such witnesses in such a cause, it is perfeetly extraordinary, but perfectly consistent with the whole conduct of the parties, to intrude observations.
Mr. Pigot. And with such a witness, in such a cause, it deserves a reprehension, and I wish it was in my power to give it such a reprehension as it deserves.
Mr. Pigot. You came here to-day without any subpæna :-Yes, in company with a Gentleman I work for. Is he a witness too?--No, I believe not.
Have you feen Gilmore to-day at all ?-Yes, I have, but had no conversation concerning this.
No, that I dare say.-----He was in the room, there was no conversation about this business.
You never heard by any accident that any reward was to be given ?--I do not wish for any reward.
I know you do not wish for it, because I know you are quite above it; but I want to know whether you ever heard of it by any accident S_Vo, never.
You never read the newspapers I never saw it in the newspapers.
You never read any hand bills that are stuck up at the corners of streets ?--I never, saw it.
Did you never cast your eyes to the corners or ends of streets, or those places where they flick up hand bills --I have seen different things, but I never saw that,
You read such things fometimes, they interest you a little ?-Unless I am going by, I do not take any notice; they are things that do not concern me, but this I never saw nor never heard of.
There were some marrow-bones and cleavers at the front of the Hustings ?-Yes.
That was before Caslon was killed, was it not ?-- Yes, and I don't know how long after; they were there before and after the time I staid.
The marrow-bones and cleavers were there before?_They were there before at the
JOHN JOSEPH sworn.
Examined by Mr. Sylvester. Was you at Covent Garden on the roth of May ?-Yes, I am a coal-porter in Ducklane, Westminster. Did you
see the poor man that was killed struck? I do not know Gentlemen whether that was the man or not.
Where did the man stand that you saw struck ?-He stood within fix or eight yards of the
pump. How was he dressed ?-In a snuff coloured brown coat, and green shag waistcoat; to the best of my knowledge, he had a round hat on, and his own hair.
Where was he struck ?-On the left side of his head.
What was he struck with ?-With a flat bludgeon, the nob of the bludgeon was flat.
Describe the end of it?- The head of the bludgeon was flat.
Who struck him that blow on the head ?-Genileinen, I cannot swear that; I cannot swear: that the man that Patrick Nicholson struck was the man that was inurdered ; 3 E 2