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increased; and as it could not be confined to England only, it would tend rather to lessen the value of gold, and in proportion to raise the price of commodities. So far, that tendency might itself be beneficial to the agricultural interest.

The motion was agreed to, and a Select Committee appointed.

PLAN FOR PAYING OFF THE NAVY FIVE PER CENTS.

March 8.

On bringing up the Report of the Bill, brought in by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, for paying off the Navy Five Per Cents., Mr. Tierney and Mr. Ellice objected, not to the principle of the plan, but to the mode in which it was to be carried into effect.

Mr. HUSKISSON said, he thought there could be little doubt that the plan was consistent with the principles of public faith and of law. With respect to the right of paying off the Navy Five Per Cents., the right honourable gentleman opposite had alluded to a clause in the act of the 37th of the King, which stated, that the Five Per Cents. were not to be paid off until twenty-five millions of the national debt should have been redeemed. The words of that Act, he was willing to confess, would admit of various-constructions; but there was one construction which, he thought, could not, with any appearance of reason, be put upon them. It could not be contended, that the condition would not be fulfilled until the debt, as it stood in 1797, should be reduced by twenty-five millions.

It might, perhaps, be argued, that if the Government borrowed with one hand, to pay off debt with another, though the debt might be nominally reduced, the condition would not be fulfilled, because, in fact, the country, while

it was paying off debt in one way, would be increasing debt in another. But the country had bonâ fide paid off twenty-five millions of debt, by the redemption of the landtax. Unless, therefore, gentlemen were to contend, that the country at the present day was bound to reduce the debt by twenty-five millions below what it was in 1792, when it amounted to two hundred and thirty millions; or that any bonâ fide reduction of the debt did not amount to a redemption, it was plain that the condition, as stated in the act, had been fulfilled, and there could be no doubt that Parliament had a right to deal with the five per cents. in the manner proposed. The honourable member for Coventry had stated, that in the course of eight years, the saving to the country would amount but to a million. Undoubtedly, if they looked only to the nominal amount of the debt, the honourable gentleman might entertain that view of the question; but, looking to the burthen which was actually upon the country, the first effect of the measure would be, to diminish that burthen by a sum of 1,200,000l. forthwith.

With respect to the complaint, that sufficient time had not been given to creditors to express their dissent, the House would bear in mind, that the public, since the resolution of his right honourable friend, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, had been moved in the House, on the 22d of February, had been put in possession of the plan. And, after all, what had the creditor to decide upon? The proposition was this either to pay off the creditor his full demand, or to give him 1057. in the four per cents. ; in fact, whether he should take his 100%., or accept of what was better. Had there been more time given, it would have led to unfair speculations. The right honourable gentleman had desired the House to wait for the result

Mr. Edward Ellice.

of the negociations between Russia and Turkey. But, if the country was not to pay off a part of its debt, bearing a high rate of interest, until the state of Europe should be entirely settled, they would lose every chance of redeeming their debt. Every public event was likely to

affect, more or less, the state of public credit. He thought that sincerity and good-faith marked the whole plan of his right honourable friend. The parties had nothing to complain of: they advanced their money to the State, on the express understanding, that, at a certain period, that debt was likely to be paid off: the terms that were offered were the amount of their debt in money, or a security, which was more advantageous. The legislature was only doing that, which, upon every principle, they were bound to do, for the benefit of the country.

MALT DUTY REPEAL BILL-PUBLIC BREWERSLICENSING SYSTEM.

March 18.

On the order of the day being read, for bringing up the report of the Additional Malt Duty Repeal Bill,

Mr. HUSKISSON Said, he begged to express the regret he felt at having been absent on a former evening, when some conversation had arisen upon the subject of this bill. He had been informed that, upon that occasion, it was said that the repeal of so considerable a portion of the malt duty would not lead to any diminution in the price charged by the brewers for their beer; and that whenever the Chancellor of the Exchequer thought it right to remit a portion of the tax, the brewers had only to express their

the

great obligations to him for having done so, and to put bonus thus remitted into their own pockets. The House knew, that the whole amount of the additional malt duty, including Ireland, was about 1,500,000l.; and he was not overstating the proportion of that tax upon malt consumed by the brewers, when he estimated it at nearly five-eighths of the whole consumption. Upon this estimate, therefore, the bonus which the brewers expected to put into their own pockets, was about 800,000. Now, he could not believe that, when his right honourable friend had proposed the repeal of what was considered so heavy a burden, he intended that the relief should be intercepted by the brewers, and that he was only to be thanked by them for the sum which it would put into their pockets. Nor would the public, he was satisfied, submit to have such a bonus arrested, and diverted from the channels into which it was intended to flow. When such an interposition was avowed, he thought the House ought to interfere and prevent the intentions of the legislature from being frustrated by the brewers.

What was the state of the case upon which they had been legislating? The price of barley had become depressed to a degree, which could find no parallel for the last twenty or thirty years. Under these circumstances, it was considered, that a repeal of a large portion of the malt duty would, by increasing the consumption, afford, indirectly, some relief to the barley grower, while at the same time it went directly to remit a tax which affected the price of beer. The argument on which the legislature proceeded was quite intelligible: it was, he repeated, that, by relieving the article from the burden of a tax, its necessarily cheaper price would augment the consumption, and give a proportionate relief both to the buyer and the grower. That being their intention, it was the bounden

duty of the House not to suffer it to be defeated in any quarter. Neither the grower nor the public, both of whose interests ought to be looked at, should be disappointed in the operation of a measure like this. He knew it was said, that all who could provide a barrel, or buy a single bushel of malt, might brew at home with more advantage than resort to the brewer. This was very well put, where the parties were in a condition to avail themselves of it; but the great bulk of the people could not brew for themselves, and therefore ought to be protected. He believed that the repeal, under any circumstances, would be attended with this good effect-that through its operation, farmers would be induced to brew at home, and give a proportion of their beer, instead of an equivalent amount in money, to their labourers. The latter, by such an arrangement, would get a much larger quantity of beer, and for a much smaller sum, than they could now obtain from the brewers.

It would also well become the licensing magistrates to inquire into the prevailing system of leasing public houses; which had been carried to such an enormous extent, that there was scarcely a free public house to be found. When such combinations-he would not use so odious a word as monopoly-existed, and by their arrangements had the power of determining when the price of beer should be raised, and when it should be lowered, it would be the duty of magistrates to consider the propriety of withdrawing some of the licenses from houses at present possessing them, and handing them over to free houses. But, as arrangements of this nature, however essential, must be tardy in their operation, the House would, perhaps, see the necessity of carrying into full effect the intention of the legislature;—which was, that the consumer should directly have the benefit of the repeal of the tax

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